I totally disagree. Industrial safety (and every kind of safety) has vastly improved, even to the point of there now being a pathological safetyism problem.
hmmm, while improvements have been made to safety, there are a lot of examples to question your premise of a "pathological safetyism problem". I'm not sure that the families of the Lac Magantic rail tragedy would agree with your premise for example. I could go on about pick-up trucks with their too bright headlamps & pedestrian killing size taking over the single person vehicle market, but shall we just leave it there?
Any data you look at shows safety improvements, literally everywhere, in all sectors, in every avenue of human life since 1920-ish. Its an entirely different world frankly. There remain accidents of course (Megantic was a mess obviously). Its also possible that due to the on-going emphasis on diversity hires, the competence problem accelerates and safety goes into decline (preventable accidents statistically increase). Safetyism is an attitude, newly growing, where people consider 'safety-first' vs cost-benefit analysis. You can see this in Public Health attitudes towards vaccine mandates and lockdowns, where dumb people made comments like 'even one death is too many'. THAT is safetyism.
I'm not sure that the Lac Megantic DISASTER where one (1!) person was responsible for the operation of a full train of Crude & other chemicals that resulted in dozens of deaths & the destruction of a small downtown can be described as a "mess". The issue isn't safety first vs cost benefit analysis, that's a false equivalency. What set of criteria that goes into decisions on rules & guidelines is the issue. Sadly the wants of the vested interests often outweigh the needs of the vast majority.
Yes Megantic was a huge disaster of course. It is NOT a false equivalency to condemn safety first thinking against cost benefit analysis because it is increasingly carried out, at least rhetorically. During COVID countless public officials said exactly that even one death was too many and policies were enacted that did not look at the big picture, because if any of them said in today's charged environment that other factors matter too, they got called Grandma Killers.
I do not believe we can be safe enough. For example, Michigan is #1 for PFAS pollution. For years, companies dumped into the environment and contaminated ground and underground water. You can not eat the fish taken out of some lakes.
In 2023, US Judge warned Flint officials to complete the replacement of lead piping supplying water to homes. This is an old issue going back a decade. That the state and the city are still not fixing this is problematic. Whether the water is treated properly or not, lead piping should be replaced.
Gelman Sciences Ann Arbor Michigan watered their grass with a mixture of water and 1,4-dioxane. It was thought by the owner and others sunlight would breakdown the 1,4-dioxane. It didn'e and many were drinking bottled water. This is still going on in 2023.
"We have written before about how 31,000 Americans died on the roads last year because of stupid -- drunk, unbuckled or speeding. In Halifax 100 years ago, thousands were killed or injured because of stupid." People believe they have a right to go as fast as they wish on highways. It is dangerous as the amount of time to react is lessened. Add to this, tailgating because they can not exceed the speed limit when someone else is passing another vehicle. It is all about them.
We still are endangered by poor and bad practices. Much of it is due to enforcement.
I learned about the Halifax explosion when my wife and I spent our honeymoon in Nova Scotia, and no it’s not a unique occurrence nor the last such incident.
Mushroom cloud image shown is actually from the 1945 explosion of a munition dump on the eastern shore of Bedford Basin. At least they learned to move munitions outside the city. That blast still has neighbouring woods and anchorages off limits due to possible left over ordnances, and the city now grows around and ever closer to what is still an active military storage area.
The 1918 mushroom cloud is much more impressive and can be seen on the wikipedia page.
I totally disagree. Industrial safety (and every kind of safety) has vastly improved, even to the point of there now being a pathological safetyism problem.
hmmm, while improvements have been made to safety, there are a lot of examples to question your premise of a "pathological safetyism problem". I'm not sure that the families of the Lac Magantic rail tragedy would agree with your premise for example. I could go on about pick-up trucks with their too bright headlamps & pedestrian killing size taking over the single person vehicle market, but shall we just leave it there?
Any data you look at shows safety improvements, literally everywhere, in all sectors, in every avenue of human life since 1920-ish. Its an entirely different world frankly. There remain accidents of course (Megantic was a mess obviously). Its also possible that due to the on-going emphasis on diversity hires, the competence problem accelerates and safety goes into decline (preventable accidents statistically increase). Safetyism is an attitude, newly growing, where people consider 'safety-first' vs cost-benefit analysis. You can see this in Public Health attitudes towards vaccine mandates and lockdowns, where dumb people made comments like 'even one death is too many'. THAT is safetyism.
I'm not sure that the Lac Megantic DISASTER where one (1!) person was responsible for the operation of a full train of Crude & other chemicals that resulted in dozens of deaths & the destruction of a small downtown can be described as a "mess". The issue isn't safety first vs cost benefit analysis, that's a false equivalency. What set of criteria that goes into decisions on rules & guidelines is the issue. Sadly the wants of the vested interests often outweigh the needs of the vast majority.
Yes Megantic was a huge disaster of course. It is NOT a false equivalency to condemn safety first thinking against cost benefit analysis because it is increasingly carried out, at least rhetorically. During COVID countless public officials said exactly that even one death was too many and policies were enacted that did not look at the big picture, because if any of them said in today's charged environment that other factors matter too, they got called Grandma Killers.
Respectfully, I think you're just being silly as you don't seem to understand the idea of a cost benefit analysis.
Lloyd:
I do not believe we can be safe enough. For example, Michigan is #1 for PFAS pollution. For years, companies dumped into the environment and contaminated ground and underground water. You can not eat the fish taken out of some lakes.
In 2023, US Judge warned Flint officials to complete the replacement of lead piping supplying water to homes. This is an old issue going back a decade. That the state and the city are still not fixing this is problematic. Whether the water is treated properly or not, lead piping should be replaced.
Gelman Sciences Ann Arbor Michigan watered their grass with a mixture of water and 1,4-dioxane. It was thought by the owner and others sunlight would breakdown the 1,4-dioxane. It didn'e and many were drinking bottled water. This is still going on in 2023.
"We have written before about how 31,000 Americans died on the roads last year because of stupid -- drunk, unbuckled or speeding. In Halifax 100 years ago, thousands were killed or injured because of stupid." People believe they have a right to go as fast as they wish on highways. It is dangerous as the amount of time to react is lessened. Add to this, tailgating because they can not exceed the speed limit when someone else is passing another vehicle. It is all about them.
We still are endangered by poor and bad practices. Much of it is due to enforcement.
With you Lloyd
I learned about the Halifax explosion when my wife and I spent our honeymoon in Nova Scotia, and no it’s not a unique occurrence nor the last such incident.
So Lloyd, how much risk needs to be removed from Life and what will the cost (money, opportunities, other actions) be for removing all risk?
And do we have the technology to actually do so?
Mushroom cloud image shown is actually from the 1945 explosion of a munition dump on the eastern shore of Bedford Basin. At least they learned to move munitions outside the city. That blast still has neighbouring woods and anchorages off limits due to possible left over ordnances, and the city now grows around and ever closer to what is still an active military storage area.
The 1918 mushroom cloud is much more impressive and can be seen on the wikipedia page.
Yikes! I will replace, I had to find new photos because they were not in my archives.
I should have just read the notes on the photo! I have replaced the photo, thanks very much for pointing it out.
I think the fact we've had more than one explosion supports your point.